Hoping someone can clarify something for me.  I was playing in a 4 ball better ball stableford competition a while ago and on one particular hole my partner holed out netting 2 points.  I couldn't do any better but took my putt just for a bit of practice, and also holed it. 

as we walked onto the next tee, our marker in the other pair said "what did you score on that hole again." to which the answer was two points. "who scored?" he said. "it doesn't matter" I said "we both got a shot there so we were both 5 nett 4 for 2 points"

You would have thought i'd suggested i'd seen him kicking his ball out of the rough!! 

there then ensued a brief but impassioned argument, with him saying "it's the first one in the hole who's score goes on the card." and me saying "how can it matter, we both scored the same there for our team".  "it matters" is all he kept saying.

Recently someone else said something similar to me. 

Can anyone clarify a) is this a usual rule, and b) what possible difference can it make as long as the right score is attributed to the right player and the handicap is applied correctly as per the competition rules? 

The "normal" thing to do is write down the gross and points of the person who holes out first, although to be honest he could put down either score if you also holed out correctly.

By the way, stop wasting time!

Or you could really confuse him and tell him to just write BOTH gross scores in the relevant columns!

pasty wrote (see)</blockquote>

By the way, stop wasting time!

</blockquote>

do you mean on the next tee or on the previous green?  Because the next hole is/was a long par 3 which is a call up hole - there is always a wait on the tee there.  for the same reason, with no-one waiting to play to the green behind us, i was fine to have a practice putt    

i'm all for keeping the pace of play up but i'm f'd if i'm going to use my only opportunity each week to play golf to run around the course as if i'm dying to get back to the clubhouse for a sh$$!!!! 

Ooohh, touchy

i just thought i would clarify the situation with a few more details so you were able to make a more informed comment 

betterball means you put the best score down so if they are the same does it matter?we only play with partners off the same handicap otherwise its too confusing at our age.

I've come across this rule of first one in goes on the card. Only time I've ever come across a reason is for bragging rights as to how many holes each player came in on. I mark all scores down but only record the best for the team. That's because I like to see how I'm doing for the complete round.

Wouldn't it matter on count back?

No issue regarding countback. As long as the team score is recorded, doesn't matter which partner scored.

PaulL11

When he said "the first one in the hole goes on the card "he was talking out of his arris, My partner and I often hole out for par before the other goes for the birdie or whatever, its the obvious way to play betterball, If first person to hole out scored then you couldnt do this, We also only ever put one score on the card in case of the DQ as jimp says.

sorry dno you've misunderstood slightly - obviously it's the best score for the hole that goes on the card. The argument here was where both of us had holed out for the same stableford score.  

  Are you seriously suggesting that a neatly written card that contained both gross scores would lead to disqualification???

It's not up to the players to put the correct points, just the gross score.   It is up to the committee to determine the points.

JimP (5.4 to 8.7 and back to 7.9) wrote (see)

See rule31-3 The problem with Pasty's suggestion is that if you put both scores on the card for every single hole it can lead to disqualification. I have hear of this happening. It comes under a rule which requires the card to be legible and easily understood by the committee.

Agree with Pasty

Both players are on the scorecard A & B, both gross scores can be recorded under their respective column A or B - best stableford points, dependant on handicap allowed (3/4 of full), is then put in points column.

Only the best points score need be put down - in the correct column for the player, so the handicap allowance can be checked - but some guys write both and there is no problem with that. 

On a hole where both hole out for the same points it is generally accepted that the score recorded is the first down.

. . . and it is wasting time if your partner has already holed a par and you want to also hole out - just a matter of etiquette though - but will p!ss of your fellow competitors enough to get them to make a song and dance about whose score is recorded.

Paul, you should have taken the hint  

Taz  -since you weren't there and i was, and i know all the other 3 players in the fourball pretty well for a long time now, i can assure you you're wide of the mark and the speed of play was totally irrelevant to this discussion/argument - don't turn this thread into something other than what it was meant to be. 

Unless of course you are just winding me up in which case feck off!!  

Back to JimP there is a decision that makes this whole thing a bit clearer - 33 -3/1.  

Basically it's the competitors responsibility when checking the card to make sure the the correct gross score is recorded, and it's the committe that's responsible for calculating the team's net score on each hole.  if you only record one gross score there can be no confusion. but having said that, there doesn't seem to be any prohibition on recording both on the card, or indeed doing anything more than that. 

Paul

33-3/1 deals with starting times!!!

Mind you it has made me read 33-5 para three which contradicts 31-3.

Jim you're right, 33-5 does contradict 31-3. 33-5 sounmds like you can just enter the gross scores for all players and let the committee sort it out.

Maybe not then, should read things more carefully.

Seems as long as the counting gross score is clearly identified, then that is enough. Either enter only one gross score per hole or circle the one which counts.

Paul 31-3/1 Deals with the same score being taken by both players with only one score entered but in the wrong column resulting in an incorrect team score entered by marker.

Paul L : I agree, no conflict.

It's simple, if only one player holes out then record his score in the correct column, if both hole out then record them both (just in case of queries or differences in handicap.) This does not infringe 31-3 or 33-5.

"The gross scores to count must be individually identifiable" refers to putting them in the correct column. I have encountered many inexperienced pairs who have just entered all the better ball scores in 1 column - this is not individually identifiable.

Paul L 11 wrote (see)

Taz  -since you weren't there and i was, and i know all the other 3 players in the fourball pretty well for a long time now, i can assure you you're wide of the mark and the speed of play was totally irrelevant to this discussion/argument - don't turn this thread into something other than what it was meant to be. 

Unless of course you are just winding me up in which case feck off!!  

Oooh!!!  . . . touchy   - (that's me and Pasty now)

. . . and yep - I was winding you up

. . . and I did give you exactly the same info as Steve above - and like your fellow competitor said - it does matter - because the score has to be entered in the right column - that's all.

Now I'll feck off

I thought I would email the R&A on this one and will point out that what happened in the incident I said was clearly wrong. I can only asssume that there must have other factors such as legibilty.

The R&A have advised that there is nothing against recording both scores (under rule 31-3) and that it is the committtees reponsibility to ascertain the better score (under rule 33-5).