nudging ball with club on teeing ground

03/11/2010 at 19:29
When teeing off I know that if you knock the ball off the tee then you can re-tee it, but what if you aren't using a tee and you do the same thing...ie. nudge the ball when addressing it on the teeing ground?
03/11/2010 at 20:11

Same thing Peter, as long as the nudge does not move the ball in front of the tee markers, in which case it must be replaced behind them. You can even stop - move the ball into a better spot - whatever.

The ball isn't in play until a stroke (or an attempt at a stroke) has been made from the teeing ground.

Nudging, therefore, as part of addressing a ball that is not in play will not incur a penalty but once a stroke is played at the ball, it is deemed in play - even if only knocked off a tee peg. It must then be played as it lies, when even nudges (that move the ball) are counted.

03/11/2010 at 21:44
And Peter, if you play again from the tee because your drive went out of bounds you are allowed to tee up again, BUT your new ball is in play so if you knock it off the tee you incur a penalty.
04/11/2010 at 06:37

Niblick -

Every time a ball is put into play from the teeing ground it's the same thing. No penalty if the ball is moved before the stroke.

04/11/2010 at 07:36
Ouch. How did I get that wrong? I know I use these threads to test out my knowledge and will therefore be wrong from time to time, but it is mortifying when it happens!

So that includes deciding your drive is unplayable and going back to the tee to play your next shot?
Edited: 04/11/2010 at 07:41
04/11/2010 at 07:43

Yep:

11-3/3  Original Ball Out of Bounds; Ball Played Under Stroke-and-Distance Procedure Falls Off Tee at Address

http://www.usga.org/assets/0/1181/1514/5e6357ca-4421-4dab-a626-4a0fc8b9062c.gif

Q. A player played his original ball out of bounds from the teeing ground. Under Rule 27-1, he teed up another ball. When addressing the ball, he touched it and it fell off the tee. What is the ruling?

A. There is no penalty, because a teed ball is not in play until a stroke has been made at it (see Definition of "Ball in Play"). The ball may be re-teed (Rule 11-3).

Edited: 04/11/2010 at 07:58
DH
04/11/2010 at 07:44
Yes
04/11/2010 at 16:53
I think what I may have been thinking of and allowing myself to be confused by is the situation where a player on the tee has an air shot: his ball is therefore in play and if he knocks the ball off the tee while addressing it for his 2nd shot, it is a penalty? Hope I'm right this time.

DH
04/11/2010 at 17:32
You've got it.
04/11/2010 at 17:33
Phew!

And to my embarrassment, I have to admit to an airshot a year or so ago. Was very very careful addressing the ball the second time
Edited: 04/11/2010 at 17:34
05/11/2010 at 08:37

Niblick - nothing to be embarraessed about. The problem with airshots are people NOT admitting them and claiming it was a practice swing

...But you can always tell. A player almost loosing his balance and looking like Goofy afterwards has not made a practice swing!

05/11/2010 at 08:41
I don't know if I looked like Goofy, but the real give away was that the follow through of my practice swing doesn't include sweary words
05/11/2010 at 14:20

On a related subject I have been informed that if you dislodge leaves from overhanging branches on the teeing ground with your practise swing you are considered to have "improved your lie" and hence incur a penalty - even though the ball is not actually in play.

Is this true and just how stupid is it if it is?

05/11/2010 at 14:26

It may or may not be true, and I don't see why it's stupid.

Players are not allowed to improve the lie, stance or area of intended swing, ball in play or not.

Branch broken off at teeing ground

But see this Decision too:

Leaves dislodged in practice swing

Edited: 05/11/2010 at 14:29
05/11/2010 at 16:51

I can see why you can't decide where to tee up, spot an overhanging branch and break it off then tee off from that point. Or if you have addressed the ball and break something with the backswing and stop the swing - I see that as well as you have, in my opinion, put the ball in play.

But take the instance where you place a ball on the on one side of the tee box. You know there are branches that MIGHT interfere so take a practice swing and down comes a few leaves. You then move your ball - it's not in play remember -  a few feet over and hey presto you are good to go. in this instance you MIGHT (number of leaves etc) have incurred a penalty. Daft in my opinion.

If the ball isn't in play how can you have a lie to improve?

06/11/2010 at 00:29
I can't understand a tee with overhanging branches that would interfere with your swing in the first place!
06/11/2010 at 08:42
Shouldn't happen but it does. The player will just have to tee his ball somewhere else and complain in the clubhouse afterwards.
06/11/2010 at 09:40
That's remarkable and doesn't say much for the course manager where it happens.
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