League cash query

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League cash query

My club allows an honours board for an eighteen week league competition that takes place during the winter and has also published on the website running tables including the amount of cash collected in the kitty that is eventually paid out to the winners.

The club says this winter league is not officially recognised by the club as it is run and funded (including the honours board) only by the members.

I have no objection to the odd side bet during a round, but is the above acceptable for such an overall cash prize competition?

Providing the money is within

Providing the money is within the Amateur Status limits, I see no reason why not.

To make it clear, £1 is taken

To make it clear, £1 is taken off every player each week, being at least 20 participants, during the eighteen week league period, this goes towards a cash prize to the winners at the end totalling around £400.

Appendix - Policy on Gambling, Unacceptable Forms of Gambling:

Organised events designed or promoted to create cash prizes are not permitted. Golfers participating in such events without first irrevocably waiving their right to prize money are deemed to be playing for prize money, in breach of Rule 3-1.

I am sure this goes on unofficially at many clubs, but surely if a club allows an honours board and even promotes/supports the comp on its webside there has to be something wrong?

How many are eligible to win

How many are eligible to win money and what is the top prize value?

Over 50 players take part

Over 50 players take part during the 18 weekly roll ups, all are eligible to win the accumulation of £1 that each entrant contributes every time they play, totalling around £400 in cash to the overall winner after 18 weeks.

 

Not disagreeing but which of

Not disagreeing but which of the bullet points under "Acceptable forms of Gambling" do you reckon causes a conflict.

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I now see this league result

I now see this league result and prize is nothing to do with gambling or wagering.

Participants know before the 18 week league starts and during it too, that there is prize money at the end for the winner. The prize money is simply accumulated by the numbers taking part overall. 

If you look at the “R&A guidelines on prizes for amateur golfers” it says: 

Cash Prizes: An amateur golfer must not play golf for prize money (Rule 3-1). If a cash prize is offered, all those competing in the competition would be in breach of the Rules, not just the players who accept a cash prize. 

Does it matter if the final prize money amount is not known?

I must admit I am having some

I must admit I am having some difficulty with this.

I cannot see how it differs in principle from a standard sweep run in many clubs. But the R&A seem to be quite happy with such events.

There never seems to be many

There never seems to be many participants in the thread discussions on this Forum.

If you know cash is being paid out for an 18 week comp, Rule 3-1 has to be in doubt?

I will ask the R&A to clarify? It was only a hope of a few different discussions!

Wouldn't disagree with DH

Generally leave the rules to DH, as I rarely have anything to add

 

... on this occasion it's the same, but without any disrespect, many of your threads seem to choking the life out competitions at your club just for the sake of it. Sorry, but I can't believe your making a good name for yourself there.

I must admit I have little to

I must admit I have little to do with amateur status issues.

When I hint at it with the guys up north I seem to get the 'don't stir muddy water' look.

BTatHome, its called having

BTatHome, its called having the balls to stick your head above the parapet when you think or see rules being broken or shunned, not just doing nothing to keep or get popularity. As you obviously seek?

I have been informed by the R&A I am correct, having a cash entry fee each week and a cash payout after 18 weeks is against the rules of golf.

 

Did they make ant reference

Did they make ant reference to the amount of cash?

Was there any indication about the difference with a conventional sweep?

The answer is in DH's reply

The answer is in DH's reply to the original post.

Every comp in the land pretty much has a monetary value.  This is understood and allowed for in the Rules which imposes a monetary value.  It's not the what, it's the "how much" that is the issue here

Reading the thread again, I

Reading the thread again, I think cash is the key.

..as opposed to the vouchers

..as opposed to the vouchers that Clubs use for prizes?

I guess if some folk chuck cash in a kitty, that's their business.  If an outside body puts in "cash prizes" via sponsorship.... that's different!

I defer to your knowledge if the former can fall foul of Rules. 

 

There used to be a small group of wealthy blokes at a former club of mine whose side bets were well over "prescibed limits!" :-)